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STARTING POINT WITH SOLEDAD O'BRIEN
New Video of Zimmerman; Spike Lee Apologizes For Retweet; JetBlue Pilot Subdued After Hysterical Outburst; Teens Tell Bullying Stories
Aired March 29, 2012 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome, everybody.
Our STARTING POINT this morning, the tale of the tape. There is surveillance video that shows what George Zimmerman looked like the night he killed Trayvon Martin. He described Martin as smashing his head into cement but are there wounds to prove it? We'll take a look at that this morning.
Plus, the wrong George Zimmerman. We talk to a couple that now says they are living in fear after Spike Lee retweeted their address as George Zimmerman's.
And that JetBlue captain now facing federal charges for his mid- air meltdown. Apparently, he was saying things like it's time to take a leap of faith, which is always bad for a pilot at 30,000 feet. His wife and co-pilot talking to police and say they see a completely different person that day.
It is Thursday, March 29th and STARTING POINT begins right now.
O'BRIEN: And you're right. That's Dwele "Find A Way." That's off of Roland Martin's playlist. You can tell that he's kind of dancing on the set.
Roland Martin joins our panel this morning. He's a CNN contributor.
John Fugelsang is with us as well. He's a political comedian.
And Will Cain is columnist for TheBlaze.com.
Nice to have everybody.
We're talking about this new videotape that you've all seen of George Zimmerman. In a way it would be interesting and I don't think police did this if they had actually taken photos like high quality good photos because where you could really make out any kind of damage to physical bruising or injury to George Zimmerman because, of course, I think a lot of case is going to hinge on that.
This surveillance tape is from the night that George Zimmerman killed Trayvon Martin comes from the police station. It was obtained by ABC News.
And you can see in it George Zimmerman gets out of the police cruiser and eventually is led into the building. And it's going to be important for lots of reasons. First, very different images of this shot that we showed you originally was a 2005 mug shot of Zimmerman. And in the videotape, you see Zimmerman wearing a red jacket that's been described as wet after police describe him -- saying like he got wet from lying on the grass.
Lots of attention has been paid to the physical condition of both Trayvon Martin and George Zimmerman. And, of course, you don't see I think is going to be a big question as well, you don't see blood streaming out of George Zimmerman from the videotape. You don't see bandages and, of course, that doesn't seem to match claims of that he was beaten and had his head slammed against concrete for more than a minute, which comes from George Zimmerman's father.
Trayvon Martin's mother reacted to videotape last night when she talked to Piers Morgan. Here's what she said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SYBRINA FULTON, TRAYVON MARTIN'S MOTHER: This video is icing on the cake. This is not the first part of evidence that they have had. They have had the 911 tapes and they have also had witnesses. This is in addition to what the Sanford Police Department already has. This video is clear evidence that there is some problem with this case and that he needs to be arrested.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Lou Palumbo is a former investigator with the Nassau County Police Department. He's now director of the Elite Intelligence and Protection Agency.
It's nice to have you. Nice to see you again.
So when you see this videotape, what sticks out to you?
LOU PALUMBO, ELITE INTELLIGENCE AND PROTECTION AGENCY: Well, I don't see any real protracted injury number one. You hit on an interesting point earlier -- in law enforcement, if we had a person with substantial injuries, we would take photographs of that because at some point in time, if you got into a court proceeding, you'd have to produce those photos for the jury so they could appreciate the gravity of the alleged assault.
There really doesn't seem to be anything more than miniscule if that at all in these photos. But the thing I do want to say to you, I'm not really too preoccupied with this tape. I mean, there's an inherent problem with this case and it stems from the very nature of the interaction of Mr. Martinez with --
O'BRIEN: You mean, Zimmerman, George Zimmerman.
PALUMBO: Zimmerman, I'm sorry, and Mr. Martin. Exactly.
He had no authority to approach this young man on any level. So he precipitated this contact. Whatever Mr. Martin did, he probably did it standing his ground, in his own defense -- to be very candid with you.
So, I'm a little confused about how the case has proceeded. There's been a time line has been established by a 911 call. There's further information supported through conversations with the girlfriend that sets into play a pattern of Zimmerman's behavior that clearly outlines the fact that he precipitated this confrontation.
There's no affirmative defense for him in using a firearm, number one. The second thing is that none of these community watches are you authorized and I just had a phone call with someone in Florida to carry a weapon in any capacity. Something you might find interesting as well. I'm licensed to carry a concealed weapon anywhere in the United States, District of Columbia and it's territories. If I want to go to Florida and work and carry a concealed weapon in work capacity, I have to obtain a different permit.
He would have had a permit to carry a concealed weapon for work purposes.
WILL CAIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Something you said had a huge assumption that I have questions about. This is our job to ask questions. You said Zimmerman precipitated this incident. He initiated the confrontation.
Do we know that to be true? I mean, my position is I'm seeking the facts, seeking the circumstances. Do we know that to be true? Because that's not his story, right? His story is that Trayvon approached him.
And I want to be clear about something: I'm not defending Zimmerman. What I'm trying to find out is the truth.
PALUMBO: I would say that if you wanted to look at this concept called probable cause based on the fact that Mr. Zimmerman made a phone call to 911 and they informed him basically to stand down.
CAIN: Right, true.
PALUMBO: Yet for some reason, he mysteriously had contact with this individual. Mr. Martin had a phone call with his girlfriend indicating he was being followed by this individual. I think there's enough -- you want to call it circumstantial, I'd say there's cause enough to believe that he precipitated this.
O'BRIEN: And let me play a little bit of what George Zimmerman's father had to say. He's in shadow because, obviously, many people in this case are concerned about their safety. Let's play that first and then we'll get your question on the other side.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, GEORGE ZIMMERMAN'S FATHER: He was punched in the nose. His nose was broken. He was knocked to the concrete. Trayvon Martin got on top of him and started beating him in the face and his nose, hitting his head on the concrete.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: He went onto say this. He said, after nearly a minute of being beaten, George was trying to get his head off the concrete trying to move with Trayvon on him into the grass and in doing so his firearm was shown.
And so, that's the first time you hear about the father's description clearly it sounds like being informed by his son's telling him. So, it sounds to me like he's saying the weapon was concealed the entire time. This sticks out to me.
PALUMBO: He shouldn't have had the weapon on him to begin with especially if he was operating in this capacity. There are guidelines. I just indicated to you before that I had a conversation with someone who was involved with some of these community watches and that's one of the things they're specific about.
I also want to mention to you the fact that we have auxiliary police in New York sitting in Nassau County, Suffolk county, they're uniform. None of them permitted to carry weapons.
Mr. Zimmerman did not have formal training in any law enforcement environment. But more importantly, he lacked experience. All he was required to do, all of the expectation is even in private security is to observe and report. That's all they are looking for you to do.
I think there's a whole other dynamic that's driving Mr. Zimmerman that I don't necessarily want to speak to at this point. I'm not --
O'BRIEN: Racial dynamic.
PALUMBO: I think it has to do with his personality defects.
O'BRIEN: Right. Roland has a question.
ROLAND MARTIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: If someone, you're observing this case. Let's say you go the scene and someone says I saw this guy. He looked suspicious. And then I guess you would ask, well, what was he doing? Was he peering into a window or whatever? That person wasn't.
And this person gets out of their car and then is approaching him or looking for him because he said he was looking for him and he lost contact with them. That means he got out of his vehicle where he originally was to go look for him or whatever and so when you say pursue, that's really what you're talking about.
PALUMBO: Absolutely. And you have to put yourself in the mindset of this young man, Mr. Martin. This kid grows up in the city. He's a rough --
PALUMBO: Absolutely right. He has some unknown male approach him and he doesn't know what his intentions are. Mr. Zimmerman did not have a shield or an ID card as we're provided in law enforcement that he could walk up to and identify himself. He said, listen, I just want to ask you a couple questions and give the kid an explanation.
We've had break-ins in vehicles and we've had burglaries, you know, something that would give you some type of cause to confront him.
MARTIN: Even neighborhood watch smock or something.
JOHN FUGELSANG, POLITICAL COMEDIAN: Yes, but he didn't have authority to confront. I have a question.
In New York state, if an individual had been arrested for assaulting a police officer, would that individual ever be allowed to carry a concealed loaded 9 millimeter?
PALUMBO: No, it's a felony in the state of New York. And you cannot be licensed to carry a concealed weapon or own a concealed weapon, or any weapon after you're a convicted felon.
So, the answer to that question is straightforward. As well as the fact you lose your right to vote and some other little privileges.
O'BRIEN: Well, all of these issues are raised as conversation continues. I was sort of surprised that you can kill someone and not be arrested, even if just the arrest led to not being convicted. But that's surprising.
MARTIN: The problem is the statute. That's the problem.
O'BRIEN: Yes, the statute certainly. They said their hands are tied.
But we've got to get headlines.
Lou, nice to see you. Thanks so much.
PALUMBO: My pleasure.
O'BRIEN: You know, Lou from lots of past experiences as well.
We've got to get to Christine. She's got a look at the headlines for us.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.
And breaking news right now in Philadelphia at the airport there. Police are telling us a man with an unknown homemade device has been apprehended at the Philadelphia airport. We have our own journalist on their way right now and a federal law enforcement official is telling us at this hour there's no indication that this is a terrorism incident.
But again, they have someone in custody. He never got on the plane, but was apprehended with an unknown homemade device when he was trying to go through the security checkpoint there in Philly.
So we've got people on the way. But plan maybe for a little bit of delay because there is a law enforcement situation happening in Philadelphia.
OK. The JetBlue pilot who had to be wrestled down midair, he is now facing federal charges and 20 years in prison for interfering with his own flight crew. And now, for the first time, we're here minute by minute details from inside the cockpit about what looks like an apparent mental breakdown. The first officer told police that Captain Clayton Osbon scolded air traffic controllers for making too much noise.
Then he turned off all of the radios in the cockpit and also yelled, "We need to take a leap of faith." Passengers were eventually able to pin him down after a quick thinking co-pilot locked the door on him, and wouldn't let him back in the cockpit.
The White House keeping a low profile this morning, is refusing to speculate about the possibility of the Supreme Court declaring the president's health care overhaul unconstitutional. After three days of arguments, many legal analysts believe the justices may strike down the key provision in the law, the individual mandate -- which would require most Americans to buy health insurance or pay a penalty. A decision from the high court is expected sometime in June.
GOP front runner Mitt Romney reportedly planning renovations to his California beach home that would make the White House look like a shack. The plan is even includes an elevator just for the family cars. The Romneys plan to transform their 3,000 square foot seaside home in La Jolla into an 11,000 square foot home, to make space to host the candidate's five children and 16 grandchildren.
Romney's campaign says the plans are on hold until the campaign is over.
And awkward moment for Joe Biden during a speech at a factory in Iowa. The vice president was attempting to thank a community president named Dr. Theresa Paper and I didn't come out quite right.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let me say it again: Thank you, Terry. Thank you, Dr. Pepper, and thank you, Chancellor -- Dr. Paper -- and thank you, Chancellor, for this partnership.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROMANS: So is that a gaffe, Soledad, or is that just somebody how has to remember an awful lot of names.
O'BRIEN: It's a gaffe from someone who has to remember an awful lot. Joe Biden makes gaffes regularly.
MARTIN: That's what makes him Joe.
O'BRIEN: Which makes him Joe.
MARTIN: He's average Joe.
O'BRIEN: He just said, Dr. Pepper.
All right. Thank you, Christine.
Still ahead on STARTING POINT: another one for the presidential playlist. You heard him sing Al Green.
O'BRIEN: Now, they are remixing the president.
And Spike Lee is apologizing for retweeting out a couple's address as George Zimmerman's address and it might be too late. We're going to talk to that couple now to see what they want.
Will Cain's playlist, Chris Knight, "It Ain't Easy Being Me." That's how I'm feeling today.
We'll be back in a moment.
O'BRIEN: Welcome back, everybody. Spike Lee is apologizing to a Florida couple in their 70s. Elaine and David McClain were forced to move out of their home out of fear after their address was re-tweeted by Lee. The address had been erroneously posted on Twitter by Lee who said it belonged to George Zimmerman, the man who shot and killed 17- year-old Trayvon Martin.
And Spike wrote on Twitter last night, "I deeply apologize to the McClain Family for re-tweeting their address. It was a mistake. Please leave the McClain's in peace. Justice in court." Now, Elaine had a son who once leave at her home and his middle name is George, last name Zimmerman.
Elaine and David McClain are with me this morning along with their attorney, Matt Morgan. Nice to see the three of you. Thanks for being with us. Mrs. McClain, if you will, how did you figure out that your address had been given out on Twitter. I'm going to just go with the assumption that you're not tweeting regularly. ELAINE MCCLAIN, FORCED OUT OF HOME AFTER SPIKE LEE RETWEET: I've never tweeted. I don't even text. So, -- but the only reason it started to stir our mind about it is we had some reporter and cameraman at our door on Sunday asking for George. My husband said we don't have a George that lives here and don't know anyone, and then, the next day we got hate mail. And then, the next day we had many, many cameras coming.
O'BRIEN: Well, so, you knew something had happened. Tell me a little bit about the hate mail, Mr. McClain. What details about hate mail can you tell me?
DAVID MCCLAIN, FORCED OUT OF HOME AFTER SPIKE LEE RETWEET: Well, it was an envelope addressed with a black magic marker to George Zimmerman at our address. And, on the back of it in a red magic marker, it said, "taste the rainbow." And I guess that's the Skittles catch phrase. And then, it had a circle with a V on the back of it. I didn't open it. I just didn't really know what to do with it.
O'BRIEN: Yes. So, you obviously started getting very concerned about your safety. What was the decision that you decided to make?
DAVID MCCLAIN: Well, we decided -- we called the police and reported it to them. And they --
ELAINE MCCLAIN: We left home.
O'BRIEN: You moved into a hotel, right?
ELAINE MCCLAIN: We left home.
DAVID MCCLAIN: Yes. We left home. Moved into a hotel.
O'BRIEN: And how has that been for you? I mean, obviously, now, you're not in your house. I would imagine like getting meals and all that other stuff that you have to do has just become a challenge.
ELAINE MCCLAIN: It's been really, really hard. Really hard. I have a heart condition and high blood pressure, and this has just skyrocketed it. We have a lovely, small home and not to be able to go to your home, not to be able to -- anything, clothes, because we just got out as fast as we could.
O'BRIEN: Oh, my goodness. So, as you know, Marcus Higgens (ph), who was, apparently, the first person to tweet your address and then Spike Lee who then retweeted the address have both apologized and I'm curious to know if you accept those apologies or how you feel about them since your life has been upended.
ELAINE MCCLAIN: We definitely accept the apology. We just don't want this to happen to anybody else. The social media has no accountability to anybody. They can put anything on there, and they don't care. They don't care how it affects other people's lives.
O'BRIEN: I know, Mr. McClain, that you have called for retracting the tweet, which is pretty much impossible to do, and I heard Mrs. McClain, you say that maybe there was sort of an opportunity to get together with Spike Lee Or somebody else to make some kind of change. What would you like to see come out of this really pretty terrible situation?
ELAINE MCCLAIN: I would like to see our town, Sanford, to make strides to work together to understand people and just work through the process. I do believe in America we have a good process. It may take longer than what we want, because we want instant fix it. I really feel that we just have to do some healing and get rid of all this hatred.
O'BRIEN: So, what happens next? At what point will you feel safe enough to go back to your house, and maybe, Mr. Morgan, you can jump in as the attorney here. What point do you say to your clients, OK, I think this is died down enough that you can be safe?
MATT MORGAN, FAMILY ATTORNEY: Well, I've reached out to Spike Lee's camp, and I've actually received word from one of his publicists. And I'm hopeful that we're going to be able to talk today. But first of all, we're grateful for his apology. But, we also would like a formal retraction.
I think once a retraction is posted in a public manner, then they'll be in a position where they'll feel safe to go home, because then the world will no for sure that George Zimmerman is not living at their home address. And so, at that point in time, I think, their safety would be OK, and they'd be able to return home.
O'BRIEN: All right. And I certainly hope that their calls for everybody to be calm are heeded by everybody involved in this case, because it definitely feels like the tensions are being ratcheted up on all fronts. Elaine and David McClain, thanks for talking with us. I know this has been a really tough thing for you, so we appreciate your time. And Mr. Morgan, as well, the family attorney, thank you.
ELAINE MCCLAIN: You have a blessed day
O'BRIEN: Thank you. And likewise. I appreciate that.
If you're going to head to work and you don't want to miss the rest of our show, you can check out our live blog on our website, which is CNN.com/STARTINGPOINT.
Ahead this morning, yelling about a "leap of faith" and some other new terrible details about that JetBlue pilot's mid air meltdown. How was he at the controls when he lost control? Is this a wake-up call for the entire industry? We're going to talk to the former inspector general for the Department of Transportation.
Plus, remember this moment? President Obama singing. Starts off soft.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: He's taking on some other songs this morning. You don't want to miss this one. You're watching STARTING POINT. We're back right after this short break.
O'BRIEN: That song is a little slow for our mornings usually except when Maxwell e-mails and says this is what he'd like to hear. I say, you got it, Maxwell. Thank you for watching.
MARTIN: He's watching right now and love Soledad --
O'BRIEN: And that is Sam Cook's "Summertime." So, we'll play anything you want, Maxwell. Maybe, we can play (INAUDIBLE)
MARTIN: So, Soledad would love to have you in studio.
O'BRIEN: Well, I thank you for negotiating that. I appreciate it.
Speaking about singing, President Obama, you know, I mean, you know, we have so much video of the president singing. Remember this moment, for example.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: He can definitely sing. He can sing.
FUGELSANG: You got to hear Joe Biden's "Free Bird."
O'BRIEN: Then there was this moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: I mean, think of the pressure. Singing with BB King right there. Yes. That's a lot of pressure. So, now he's singing the song "I'm sexy and I know it" by LFMAO. Sort of. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP) (END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Uploaded by YouTube users made from clips obviously of WhiteHouse.gov's public domain of presidential speeches. They already have the president covering Lady Gaga and Rihanna as well.
CAIN: When I'm watching that whole thing and wondering, when they get to that course, where are they going to get that sexy word polled? When did President Barack Obama say the word "sexy" at some --
O'BRIEN: He probably did. And he probably said three words that if you combined them, it could come out to sexy. I'm fairly confident the president is not working sexy --
FUGELSANG: It's like George Bush singing (INAUDIBLE) using the same technology.
MARTIN: Of course, making them sexy your body (INAUDIBLE) sexy Soledad on STARTING POINT.
O'BRIEN: Blog oh blog the panel today. All I want to talk about is Maxwell.
O'BRIEN: All right. Still ahead this morning on STARTING POINT -- I know. I love it. Jobless numbers. We're expecting them in just a few moments. We're going to bring you instant reaction from the stock market along with that.
Plus, one pilot talking about a "leap of faith" too many times. We'll speak with the former inspector general for the Department of Transportation this morning.
And remember the mother who drowned her five small children in a bathtub? We'll tell you why she could be let out of prison in just a matter of days. You're watching STARTING POINT. We're back in just a moment.
O'BRIEN: And this news is just in to CNN, the weekly jobless numbers. Christine has a closer look. Good morning, Christine.
ROMANS: Good morning, Soledad -- 359,000 unemployment claims were filed for the first time last week. That's more than economists were expecting. That means the jobless claims line was longer than expected. But this is below that key 400,000. That means that the labor market is slowly healing. So a little bit higher than economists expected but still below that 400,000.
Also updating breaking news for you now out of Philly. Police in Philadelphia now telling CNN they detained a man at the airport this morning after they found an unknown homemade device at a checkpoint. The terminal checkpoint was closed down immediately after this device was discovered about 5:45 a.m. local time and reopened about a half hour later. A federal law enforcement official tells CNN there are no indications this was terrorism, and all flights now are running on a normal schedule into and out of Philadelphia.
The Colorado forestry service is apologizing for setting a controlled burn that was designed to prevent the wildfire that it caused. More than two dozen homes have been destroyed near Denver. One family's escape through the flames was caught on a son's cell phone video. The father says they waited as long as they could before finally getting out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DOUG GULICK, FAMILY ESCAPED WILDFIRE: We loaded up the car, and the last thing I saw was this large flame shoot up and we realized we had to go right then. And we turned that corner and went from daylight into pure darkness.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROMANS: The family says they believe their home is still standing.
Andrea Yates, the Houston mom who drowned her five children in a bathtub back in 2001, may soon be allowed to leave her psychiatric hospital to attend church. Yates' attorney says he expects doctors at the state hospital in Texas to file a letter to the state district court within ten days recommending his client be granted a two-hour pass to attend Sunday services. This would be the first step toward a permanent release for Andrea Yates. Soledad?
O'BRIEN: Gosh, that was such a sad story when that happened.
ROMANS: It was so long ago, and it still brings chills thinking of those little kids.
O'BRIEN: Terrible, terrible story. Christine, thank you for that update.
Some new details this morning about that midair meltdown by a JetBlue pilot. Clayton Osbon is in a Texas hospital. He's in FBI custody. He's now charged with interfering with a flight crew. He was on a flight to Vegas on Tuesday he erupted into a bizarre outburst running around the cabin literally yelling incoherently about Jesus, about 9/11, about Iraq and terrorists, things that would make people freak out if they're passengers. We also know when he was in the cockpit, he turned off the radios, dimmed his control monitors. He was restrained after he tried to break back into the cockpit.
Joining us this morning is aviation attorney and former inspector general for the U.S. department of transportation Mary Schiavo, and also licensed commercial pilot John Wusage. Nice to have you both. Mary, I'll start with you. What explains this? When you heard this story unfolding with incredible details, what did you first think? MARY SCHIAVO, AVIATION ATTORNEY: My first thought is there was something wrong physically with the pilot. This has happened before although not with a pilot in this manner. But there have been passengers. One had meningitis and was not literally not able to grasp reality. There have been passengers who have had reactions to drugs. There have been pilots who have died in the cockpit. My first reaction was the man was kick but the passengers helped the co-pilot get the situation under control.
O'BRIEN: If you read the criminal complaint, which is absolutely fascinating, and we posted it on CNN.com/startingpoint because it's an incredible read. They say that Osbon tried to re-enter his code to re-enter the cockpit. He banged hard enough that the first officer thought he was coming through the door. The F.O. announced over the pa system an order to restrain Osbon, which I assume would be an order for the passengers to jump in and help out.
JOHN LUCICH, LICENSED COMMERCIAL PILOT: That had to be scary. Can you imagine hearing this is your co-pilot, please restrain the captain? I mean, it's got to be a horrifying situation. There's no doubt that the first officer did great job here. He took control of the situation and saw an opportunity. As soon as this guy left the cabin, he locks the door and keeps that guy outside. This is a guy randomly pushing buttons and shutting off the radios, yelling at controllers. This is someone who is definitely out of control.
When he started banging on the door it was reported he was saying I got to get this airplane down on the ground. I got to pull those throttles back. We're not going to Vegas. Could you imagine what he would have done had he gotten back in there that might have affected the safety of the flight?
O'BRIEN: We know some clues not just from this pilot because he's quoted as saying as I mentioned about September 11th and Iran and Iraq, and then when you look at that flight attendant who had a meltdown the other day, an American Airlines flight attendant, she was talking about 9/11. She was talking about the plane going to crash. This is the same thing, camera phone. You can hear shrieking in the background. So the common thread between the two is this sense of potential terrorism bringing the plane down. Is this sort of a post- 9/11 post-traumatic stress?
SCHIAVO: There's so many stresses on the aviation industry today not the least of which is economic, but also the security concerns and the additional -- the world that we live in today. And so that's why the FAA is probably going to reexamine whether psychiatric exams need to be included in part of the pilot review. I doubt they will order it. It will be a sweeping change. They'll probably look at the medical certificates and how we evaluate pilots and they do allow psychiatric medications, very few, but some while you fly. I think the faa will review that because the system is under a lot of stress.
O'BRIEN: Let me ask John a question. You're a pilot. If you are a pilot who is flying for an airline and you're depressed or taking medication, is it fair to say you might lie about what's going on because you don't want to get caught? LUCICH: Sure, you could absolutely lie on any of the medical forms and doctor won't know it. I've been through many first class physicals that this guy went through. Not once did I feel someone was evaluating me on a psychological basis. What's scary is this guy gets to work. Nobody notices it. He takes off. Everything is fine.
O'BRIEN: He missed a meeting. Would that be a red flag or one of those things it happens.
LUCICH: It could have been traffic. Just like --
O'BRIEN: That couldn't be a red flag.
LUCICH: It wouldn't be a red flag because you're late from work. Three hours into the flight he goes berserk. Why wasn't he yelling and ranting before?
O'BRIEN: The affidavit shows as they were taking off out of JFK, he started getting very tense and acting a little bit strangely. It's not until the 3 1/2 hours in that he's having the full meltdown.
CAIN: I want to ask John one quick question. Is your lesson from this there may be greater pressures on the airline industry or a personal issue with this guy?
LUCICH: I don't know. I'm not a doctor. But I can tell you there has to be pressure on these pilots to worry about terrorism. There's no doubt about it.
CAIN: We all have to pay more attention on our flights.
SCHIAVO: Bombs have been placed inside aircraft and got off because of intelligence. These pilots can lock that cockpit door, but if something is hidden in cargo on routine shipment, there's a lot stress on these guys and women.
O'BRIEN: All right, thank you. We appreciate it. It is terrifying to think now to be a passenger on that.
Still ahead this morning on STARTING POINT, millions trying to get rich quick. Don't start spending it yet. There are mega-odds of the mega-millions, but worth buying a ticket.
Plus, we'll talk about the film "Bully." it's heartbreaking. Looks at five families dealing with impact of bullying, and includes interviews with two families who lost children who killed themselves. Producers are now fighting for a PG-13 rating so that children can actually see this movie.
You're watching STARTING POINT. We have got a short break and we're back in just a moment.
O'BRIEN: That clip from the movie "Dumb and Dumber."
FUGELSANG: In real life she dated him.
O'BRIEN: Ridiculous odds. Everyone is talking about the same ridiculous odds in the mega millions jackpot. It's the biggest lottery award in the game's history, roughly $500 million roughly. Millions of people are dreaming. But according to the website, the chance of picking all five numbers and mega-ball is 175,711,536 to one.
CAIN: That's it.
O'BRIEN: So yes you have a better chance of being killed by lightning. Yes you have a -- that's a -- that a million to one odds, you have a -- a better chance of being killed in an asteroid collision in the year 2029.
FUGELSANG: And what are odds of the silent film winning best picture in 2012?
O'BRIEN: 300 to 1 -- Yes that too. The chances of two people making the same hole in one is 17 million to one. So those are all better odds.
O'BRIEN: But if you decide, in fact you're going to take the risk and buy a ticket, which I have done you could walk away with $359 million.
FUGELSANG: Wow that's it?
MARTIN: So when is the drawing again? Tomorrow?
O'BRIEN: The drawing is tomorrow night.
CAIN: You have a ticket?
O'BRIEN: I do.
CAIN: You did.
O'BRIEN: I'm in. But you know everybody on the staff as well are getting tickets. So I'm going to get in on that. And then I think other people are buying tickets. So I have like all these different --
FUGELSANG: Oh the pools.
O'BRIEN: I could be part of several pools.
FUGELSANG: So your odds are really like 10 million to 1 then really.
O'BRIEN: Yes, I'm packing up my office already.
All right. Still ahead this morning on STARTING POINT, we're going to talk about the film "Bully".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If they're out of your care there and someone else is just as capable as you of keeping them safe and I don't feel like that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Oh my gosh. That's a mother upset because her -- her son is being bullied at school. This film takes a look at five families dealing with the impact of bullying. The director Lee Hirsch is going to join us next.
You're watching STARTING POINT. We're back in a moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Give me no more. You just (inaudible) the test, I just gave it to you. Watch it. Can you give me no more (ph)?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: So the movie, "Bully" is -- is really a -- is an amazing film with a very powerful message. It's a documentary that looks at five families who are dealing with the impact of bullying.
Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID LONG, PARENT: Tyler was never the most athletic. When he was MP, he was always the last one to be chose. Nobody would be on his team because they said he was a geek and he's a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) and they didn't want to play with him.
And it took a toll on him early in middle school where he -- he cries. And then he got to a point where he didn't cry anymore.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Tyler committed suicide when he was 17 years old by hanging himself in his closet.
The film tells the story of Tyler and several other kids and it hits theaters in a limited release tomorrow. The makers were fighting for a PG-13 rating because they wanted kids to be able to attend the filming but it's being -- the film -- but it's being released with no rating at all. And Lee Hirsch is the director of "Bully".
So let's talk about that controversy over the rating.
LEE HIRSCH, DIRECTOR: Sure.
O'BRIEN: When I watched this film, I'm tearing up because the stories are so powerful and so sad. I literally thought at the end I'm going drag my children to see this film.
HIRSCH: Wow, thank you.
O'BRIEN: Because it is so important for them to see. With this rating issue how much of a problem is that going to be?
HIRSCH: Well it's been a big problem. I mean you know there's a double standard. The MPAA will continually give films that are very violent, celebrate, glorify, sexify violence; PG PG-13 ratings and then you have a film like this gets hit with an R because of a couple uses of the "f" word.
O'BRIEN: And it's a documentary. These are real life stories. They are not kids acting like they were --
HIRSCH: And it's -- you cannot script it, you can't control it. And it's as if -- as if any middle schooler hasn't heard that language before.
O'BRIEN: Because literally you're rolling the tape in a middle school and you are capturing what these kids are actually saying.
O'BRIEN: So let's play some clips. The story of Tyler, it's five families you focus on. The story of Tyler --
HIRSCH: Tyler's is so heartbreaking.
O'BRIEN: Oh it's brutal. This is the kid who you see pictures of him as a baby. And then he grows into a little boy. Clearly a little bit of an awkward kid. His dad --
HIRSCH: Tyler actually had Asperger's, which you know one of the things I've learned is that lots of kids with -- that are on the spectrum, special needs kids --
FUGELSANG: (inaudible) can't make eye contact and can't communicate the way we expect.
O'BRIEN: So he's that kid who is challenged by making friends in school.
HIRSCH: That's right.
O'BRIEN: And you see what his dad says about just how hard it was. Listen.
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LONG: When you're in the shower and your clothes are taken and you have no way of getting out of the gym other than walking out naked. When you're standing in the bathroom and you're urinating and kids come up and push you from behind up against the stall and against the wall and you urinate on your pants. When you're sitting in the classroom and somebody comes by and grabs your books and throws them on the floor until you pick them up (EXPLETIVE DELETED). Those are things that happened to Tyler.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: And the list goes on and on. It's a brutal story. How did you come to find these families?
HIRSCH: Well, we found this family because we -- when you make a film you are looking for stories. We were getting Google, you know news feeds every day finding out different -- because there's so much happening when you look across the country with this issue.
And we -- we've learned that they were trying -- this was five weeks after the death of Tyler -- to put a town hall meeting together to talk about what was happening in those schools. And that's how I met them. They were sort of preparing for this, trying to get community to buy into to talk about what was happening and ultimately the school district barred every one of their staff members from attending that meeting.
O'BRIEN: Let me play a clip of an administrator who you show in the morning greeting the kids. And I thought this was really, really telling. Let's play the next clip. She forces the kid who was being bullied and the bully to shake hands to sort of make it ok.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shake hands. Cole. Cole.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You are not going anywhere. He is offering his hand and let this drop. You may go. Cole, I expected more.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He criticizes me every single day.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Then why are you around him?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't. He comes to me. I try and get away from him. He follows me. And he criticizes me. Calling me a (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's not right. He shouldn't do that. You know what; he was trying to say he was sorry.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He already did and he didn't mean it. It continued on. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know what, you didn't mean it when you stuck your hand out either. So that means you're just like him, right?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MARTIN: Lee wrote a column on bullying when the incident happened in Florida when the dad got on the bus and they were picking on his daughter and he cuts the students out and threaten to kill him. And people came down on him.
And the point I made then is that the part of the problem here is that it is accepted in schools that -- look, this is just a part of kids being in school growing up.
O'BRIEN: Well, shake hands. How can you say that?
MARTIN: And -- and teachers and administrators sort of say hey you know just sort of get over it. Versus really saying I have to deal with you and call your parents in, you say, you have a problem child.
HIRSCH: People -- you know exactly, they blame the parents so often but many parents aren't actually informed by the school that their kids are engaged in bullying behavior so they don't even have the opportunity to parent in that -- yes.
O'BRIEN: Go ahead.
FUGELSANG: I want to thank you for making the film.
HIRSCH: Well, thank you.
FUGELSANG: Deeply. I sympathize with your problems with language because every curse word I ever learned I learned from another child when I was a child.
My problem and I -- I've done a lot of this as a stand up. I've done commentaries on it is -- I want to know your thoughts on this. I think one of the problems with bullying is that we're still using the word "bullying", an arcane, "Archie Comics" term. Why don't we use terms like "peer abuse", "criminal harassment", "persecution" because bullying is what the "Little Rascals" got from --
HIRSCH: It's torture.
O'BRIEN: In this film, it's so clearly torture.
HIRSCH: We don't allow any torture in America, period.
FUGELSANG: I don't think people take the term "bullying" seriously because it doesn't do justice to the kind of scorn and abuse these children face. HIRSCH: I think you are right. I thought about that a lot. I think that the word almost minimizes now the actual total experience of it.
If this happened to adults there would be police involved. There would be restraining orders. There would be charges laid. But when it happens to kids, it's just -- all of those arguments that you just said. You know, kids will be kids.
That's I think, part of this national conversation. I think the thing about a movie like this is that we can sort of step outside of the breaking news headlines and actually really get into sort of what does it mean to really A, create change but really talk about this in a way that's not in crisis but where do we go from here?
O'BRIEN: This movie is so good and it's so hard to watch. It's so painful. As a parent, I get a little teary.
HIRSCH: Don't you say that.
O'BRIEN: I will -- no, no, because it's so important. People should bring their kids as I will do even though there's the "F" word in there people have to see this movie. It's amazing.
MARTIN: Also you go to jack your kids up for bullying.
O'BRIEN: Oh God.
MARTIN: Sorry, you have to go there. You have to deal with your child.
O'BRIEN: We thank you for talking to us. Good luck on the film.
HIRSCH: Thank you all for having me. I really appreciate it.
O'BRIEN: You bet. You bet.
HIRSCH: Have a great day.
O'BRIEN: Thank you -- likewise.
We're going to get to "End Point" with the panel in just a moment.
O'BRIEN: Time for "End Point". We only have 30 seconds left. We're going to give it to Will Cain this morning -- Will.
CAIN: I want to return to the story of Spike Lee attempting to tweet out or re-tweet George Zimmerman's address in Florida, mistakenly tweeting out this elderly couple. My question is this. What if Spike Lee had been successful? What if he had tweeted out the accurate address for George Zimmerman? What was his purpose? What was he hoping to accomplish there?
O'BRIEN: That's a good question that has no answer this morning. We'll leave it at that.
O'BRIEN: Well, we got to take a turn to "CNN NEWSROOM" with Carol Costello. That begins right now.
We'll see you on STARTING POINT tomorrow morning.
Hey Carol, good morning.